Oath Creatures nowadays

[Tabris]

Hey gaise,

bc of the release of the new Liliana (and the liquidation of my 5cStaxx) I was tempted to build an Oath deck but not just pure Oath so here is just a quick "help me I am so lazy right now" attempt.

If you would build a RGBU-Oath-deck with some staxx elements and heavy planeswalker support (smokestack, deathcloud, wildfire, tanglewire and stuff)which creatures would you add nowadays (they must be castable in the deck)

-Grave Titan
-Inferno Titan
-Primeval Titan (not sure)
-Demonic Tutor Demon
-Emrakul (just because)
-Frost Titan (This poor guy need a home maybe a Wildfire deck?)
-Trench Gorger (for the lulz?)
-Fact or Fiction Sphinx

go on make some suggestions even pet cards

[malz77]

Don't know why white is excluded? White would have very sweet oath targets... But why oathing something else than Emrakul?

hmmmm Terastodon, Blightsteel Colossus, Jin-Gitaxias Core Augur

[coldcrow]

For the fun: Rasputin Dreamweaver
Demonic tutor demon
Sundering titan
sharuum (if the deck supports it)
witness

[LasH]

Hey gaise,

bc of the release of the new Liliana (and the liquidation of my 5cStaxx) I was tempted to build an Oath deck but not just pure Oath so here is just a quick "help me I am so lazy right now" attempt.

If you would build a RGBU-Oath-deck with some staxx elements and heavy planeswalker support (smokestack, deathcloud, wildfire, tanglewire and stuff)which creatures would you add nowadays (they must be castable in the deck)

-Grave Titan
-Inferno Titan
-Primeval Titan (not sure)
-Demonic Tutor Demon
-Emrakul (just because)
-Frost Titan (This poor guy need a home maybe a Wildfire deck?)
-Trench Gorger (for the lulz?)
-Fact or Fiction Sphinx

go on make some suggestions even pet cards

Competive: Primeval titan, demonic tutor demon, Baneslayer Angel, Wurmcoil engine

Semi-Competive: Inferno titan, pelakka wurm

Uncastable: BS Colossus, Emrakul, empyrial archangel

not competive/fun: fof sphinx, frost titan, trench gorger, hellkite overlord, akroma, spirit of the night, all other creatures/mythics > 7cc

Grave titan u never wanna oath into.

There are no really good choices atm, because all other creatures are overcosted and not cost efficient compared to "spells on legs". U kinda wanna have stuff like emrakul but u dont wanna draw it. It makes the deck kinda not stable enough, you have to be able to cast all your choices turn 4 or 5. Just my opinion...hf

[Tabris]

Maybe I didnt make myself clear its not a pure oath deck it is a 4c heavy Control/Staxx/Planeswalker/Wildfire deck. The exclusion of white is on purpose since I dont want to play my 5c Staxx deck anymore which would be similar to this build if I implement white again. Again I want to cast things like deathcloud, Sorin and stuff. Its a Grixis Wildfire deck with Green if you want.

It should be competitive thats why I dont think I will add stuff which dosent require an immediate answer from the opponent. The Archangel though is very good so maybe I could make an exception for this (with some of my mana artifacts I could even hard cast him) Maybe I will post the list and you get a better impression.
Sharuum would be indeed very sweet with a lot of stuff oathed in the graveyard...maybe

I was allways wondering how good a witness is in an Oath deck. She simply draws the best card from your graveyard which is huge but the question is...is this enough vs a strong board.

Why not only emrakul? Well I tried a pure Oath deck and it wasnt very good nor was it fun to play. This time I want to add Wildfire and heavy black spells and splash green for some cards (Sylvan Library etc.)

thx anyway so far

[pyyhttu]

Maybe I didnt make myself clear its not a pure oath deck it is a 4c heavy Control/Staxx/Planeswalker/Wildfire deck.

Here's my approach, maybe you'll get some ideas out of it: http://iki.fi/~pyyhttu/magic/highlander/planeswalker-staxx.txt

[LasH]

Maybe I didnt make myself clear its not a pure oath deck it is a 4c heavy Control/Staxx/Planeswalker/Wildfire deck.

Here's my approach, maybe you'll get some ideas out of it: http://iki.fi/~pyyhttu/magic/highlander/planeswalker-staxx.txt

I actually play the exact deck you describe there. Here is my list:

First my new decklist, its not 5c anymore.

Artifacts:

1 Mox Opal
1 Mox Diamond
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Worn Powerstone
1 Manalith
1 Coalition Relic
1 Spectral Searchlight
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Dimir Signet
1 Prismatic Lens
1 Grim Monolith
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Darksteel Ingot

1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Expedition Map
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Winter Orb

1 Batterskull
1 Crumbling Sanctuary

Sorcery:

1 Transmute Artifact
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Compulsive Research
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Mind Spring
1 Fabricate
1 Rhystic Tutor

1 Firespout
1 Wildfire
1 Burning of Xinye
1 Devastation
1 Death Cloud
1 Upheaval
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Destructive Force
1 Damnation

1 Bribery

1 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Inquisition of Kozilek

Lands:

1 Tropical Island
1 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands

1 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Wasteland
1 Flooded Strand
1 Misty Rainforest

5 Island
2 Mountain
3 Swamp

1 Tolaria West

1 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
1 Academy Ruins
1 Mishra's Workshop
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

1 Glimmervoid
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Great Furnace
1 Vault of Whispers
1 Darksteele Citadel

1 The tabernacle at Pendrelle Vale
1 Maze of Ith

Instant:

1 Mana Drain
1 Pact of Negation
1 Muddle the Mixture
1 Daze

1 Fact or Fiction
1 Gifts Ungiven

1 Into the Roil


Planeswalker:

1 Karn, Planeswalker
1 Liliana Vess
1 Sorin Markov
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
(1 Garruk Wildspeaker)

Enchantments:

1 Oath of Druids

Creatures:

1 Pelakka Wurm
1 Inferno Titan
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Primeval Titan
1 Wurmcoil Engine

Its better than the 5c staxx variant because its much more stable. Its even a pretty good deck in my opinion, but since goodstuff is so much better in every aspect and has not a single bad matchup, i doubt it makes sense to pilot a deck like this at a competive tournament.

Btw why is the new Liliana bringing you to this deck? I kinda dont get that (Control deck's dont wanna drop a own handcard - deathcloud is a different story). Futhermore cards like smokestack are actually much to slow and much to less effective to be played (Sadface   )

I dont know if u wanna just build a fun deck or something more competive?

[coldcrow]

For good measure, my current stax build:
Lands:

   Underground Sea
       Watery Grave
       Polluted Delta
       Verdant Catacombs
       Misty Rainforest
       Bloodstained Mire
       Marsh Flats
       Flooded Strand
       Scalding Tarn
       Creeping Tar Pit
       Mishra's Workshop
       City of Traitors
       Ancient Tomb
       Academy Ruins
   Wooded Foothills
       Arid Mesa
       Badlands
       Volcanic Island
       Steam Vents
       Blood Crypt
       Mishra's Factory
   Darksteel Citadel
       Wasteland
       Island
       Swamp
       Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
       Mountain
       The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
       Buried Ruin
       Dust Bowl
       Rishadan Port
   Vault of Whispers
       Seat of the Synod

Artifact Mana:

   Chrome Mox
       Dimir Signet
       Talisman of Dominance
       Mox Diamond
       Mox Opal
       Grim Monolith
   Rakdos Signet
       Izzet Signet
       Fellwar Stone
       Worn Powerstone
       Coalition Relic
       Thran Dynamo
       Gilded Lotus
       Talisman of Indulgence
   Darksteel Ingot
   Mind Stone

Planeswalkers:

   Liliana Vess
       Sorin Markov
       Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
       Tezzeret the Seeker
       Jace Beleren
       Jace, the Mind Sculptor
   Karn Liberated
       Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
   Chandra, the Firebrand

Disruption:

       Smokestack
   Sphere of Resistance
       Tangle Wire
       Winter Orb
   Mana Drain
   Duress
       Thoughtseize
       Inquisition of Kozilek

Library Manipulation:

   Gifts Ungiven
       Fact or Fiction
       Demonic Tutor
       Brainstorm
       Ponder
       Preordain
       Fabricate
       Transmute Artifact
       Thirst for Knowledge
       Compulsive Research
   Intuition        
       Memory Jar
   Tainted Pact
       Impulse
   Sensei's Divining Top
   Rhystic Tutor
       Concentrate

Various Artifact Goodies:

   Crumbling Sanctuary
   Thopter Foundry
       Sword of the Meek
   Crucible of Worlds
        Ensnaring Bridge
        Expedition Map

Sweepers:

       Upheaval
         Starstorm
   Damnation
       Wildfire
       Burning of Xinye
       Devastation
       Destructive Force
       Firespout
       Slagstorm
       Black Sun's Zenith
       Death Cloud

       


No creatures + Oath, I want to blank their removal, also I didn't want to add green. If you do sylv. library and oath, witness, garruk are logical.
1 Mana discard + more than usual library manipulation. I wanted to have a greater chance to do something relevant in the first turn than betting on a sol land. Also adds consistency.
No enchantments. Imho, The Abyss and nether void doesn't cut it anymore, they work only if you already hit the board with a sweeper and do nothing vs fast aggro. If you play white, humility is great since it stops all the etb-creatures.

Of course it has the usual stax problem vs RDW, you have to mulligan aggressively to find an explosive hand.

PS: I formatted it somehwat. Also I have no idea if the emphasis on lib mainuplation is justified, I only wanted to combat the gripe I had with stax decks: if you topdeck your artifact mana / wrong antiaggro tools when you don't really need them.

[Tabris]

Here is my list. Unfinished.


Lots of maybe especially the creatures to include:

metamorph ?

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/4c-oathstaxx/

[Kassow-Rossing]

Lash: How good is Crumbling Sanctuary? I haven't played it in my Staxx deck for over 15 months.
How good is Death Cloud? I've heard it should be amazing, but I couldn't get it to work twice during a two months playtesting.
How good is Mind Spring? Do you think you should also play Braingeyser?
Which is best: Inquisition or Duress? I think In. of Kozilek.

Coldcrow: How good is Crumbling Sanctuary. I haven't played it in my Staxx deck for over 15 months.
How good is Death Cloud? I've heard it should be amazing, but I couldn't get it to work twice during a two months playtesting.
Tell me about Slagstorm and Starstorm please. If you were to cut one of those, which would it be?
How good is Ensnaring Bridge in your deck? Which is better: Crumbling or Ensnaring?

Thx guys
Patrick Kassow

[Tabris]

I am not asked but I will answer anyway


Sanctuary is still awesome. So often I wish Tezz could fetch it right away. The opponent have to find an answer. It protects even PW from burn. Additionaly I highly recommend adding propaganda. Most decks cant afford the extra mana nowadays. Might give you the edge to get to turn 5-7.

Deathcloud...is the single reason I cutted white (sure you can make it work in 5c Oath/Staxx) to have more black cards in my decks (Sorin is the 2nd main reason) and support tripple black. I absolutely love that card and its most of the time the 2nd target for a tutor after Upheaval.

Mindspring I think you have to add big fat spells again in the control decks. Future Sight might be a better card. Depends on the board.

Slagstorm is a neccesary piece i think. Firespout is allways welcome to hit a random jace is also nice. (I see a lot of ppl playing rolling earthquake...which is similiar to slagstorm but maybe can be difficult if you are behind and just want to clear the board)

[LasH]

Crumbling sanctuary is necessary against rdw. It usually gives time. All you need to finish aggressive decks.

I cut deathcloud bc i didnt like the discard on me. I went into topdeck mode too, something i try to avoid.

Mind Spring is not a good card. But there is nothing better out there. Its much better than future sight in my opinion. 5 mana is alrdy 3 cards for mind spring, which you can play for sure! To abuse future sight you need a lot of cheap spells/lands/top and turns to get the maximum out of it. I dont think stax is the best deck for future sight. (I played it on my gp version but i never draw it. I would not play it without academy rector anyway)

Kozilek is better than duress atm, because of the aggro meta.

[coldcrow]

eh that list is outdated, right now I'd play alot more creatures like inferno titan, wurmcoil etc.
If you want a creatureless build, humility, the abyss and such are essential.

[Kassow-Rossing]

Thx U guys all 3 of U for the very fast answers!!

That's appreciated!


Tabris: "Sanctuary is still awesome. So often I wish Tezz could fetch it right away. The opponent have to find an answer. It protects even PW from burn. Additionaly I highly recommend adding propaganda. Most decks cant afford the extra mana nowadays. Might give you the edge to get to turn 5-7."

Oh okay I think I'll try it again. I remember I cut it back 15 months ago due to the inefficiency against my control meta, so I think you're SO right: It should have another go in my deck. I'm not sure I'll play Propaganda though. I might try Collective Restraint but I really dislike the fact that it don't protect my PW's. I think Moat, Humility and The Abyss are enough. Won't you agree? Do you think I should play Propaganda over Collective Restraint? Do you think I need 2x Propaganda (Ghostly Prison)? I did play Firespout but I'm trying Barter in Blood instead. Which would you play first if you had a choice to include only one of these: Firespout, Slagstorm or Rolling Earthquake? I have all 3 available in my collection. The only one I've never tried is Slagstorm, but it actually looks really interesting.



Lash do you think Concentrade would work instead of Mind Spring? I mean we both know the upsides and downsides of those cards so the way I see it: You would never want to cast Mind Spring for 4 (x=2) and you rarely cast it for 7 (x=5), so is Concentrade not just the right middle ground? I used Deep Analysis a few months ago and it was actually pretty good. After Oathing you rarely needed it for the win but I always felt like it was a decent card at all times and never a dead draw, which I fear Mind Spring could be. It's been two years since I've had Mind Spring in my Staxx deck, so I feel pretty rusty about my info on this card, so don't take my words for any good "Kozilek is better than duress atm, because of the aggro meta." I totally agree


Once again, thx for answering this quick.

[MarcMagic]

Oh okay I think I'll try it again. I remember I cut it back 15 months ago due to the inefficiency against my control meta, so I think you're SO right: It should have another go in my deck. I'm not sure I'll play Propaganda though. I might try Collective Restraint but I really dislike the fact that it don't protect my PW's. I think Moat, Humility and The Abyss are enough. Won't you agree? Do you think I should play Propaganda over Collective Restraint? Do you think I need 2x Propaganda (Ghostly Prison)? I did play Firespout but I'm trying Barter in Blood instead. Which would you play first if you had a choice to include only one of these: Firespout, Slagstorm or Rolling Earthquake? I have all 3 available in my collection. The only one I've never tried is Slagstorm, but it actually looks really interesting.

Lash do you think Concentrade would work instead of Mind Spring? I mean we both know the upsides and downsides of those cards so the way I see it: You would never want to cast Mind Spring for 4 (x=2) and you rarely cast it for 7 (x=5), so is Concentrade not just the right middle ground? I used Deep Analysis a few months ago and it was actually pretty good. After Oathing you rarely needed it for the win but I always felt like it was a decent card at all times and never a dead draw, which I fear Mind Spring could be. It's been two years since I've had Mind Spring in my Staxx deck, so I feel pretty rusty about my info on this card, so don't take my words for any good "Kozilek is better than duress atm, because of the aggro meta." I totally agree

It's about the casting cost and not the effect by itself why you should/may play Propaganda and Firespout. CC3 is so important because you want to survive the early turns to reach midgame and with CC4 spells like barter moat abyss and friends you won't have enough cheap game stretchers imo. Another issue why I always recommend enough <cc4 removal is Geddock Teek. He's just nuts against Staxx.

You should try Tiding and/or Breakthrough as carddraw. Concentrate never made the cut for me tbh but I think Breakthrough can be quite good because of it theoretical low cost.