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[RoE]-Review

Started by GoblinPiledriver, 13-04-2010, 05:11:24 PM

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Tiggupiru

Everybody is probably sick and tired of this by now, but I still would like to look at retrospect what I said about a set. I am aiming to get better at evaluating cards.

Sorry for the double post, but there is a character limit.

Colorless:

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMAll is dust - maybe some Stax might want this, but probably not others.

MBC could like this one too, especially those who play huge amounts of acceleration. Dunno if Staxx cares about this. Probably not.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMArtisan of Kozilek  - could theoretically see Reanimator play even though it's not as good target as Pathrazer of Ulamog. 10/9 is a big body and annihilator 2 is relevant.

Cousin Itt is just better and you shouldn't need to play it even.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 23-04-2010, 10:53:55 AMEldrazi Conscription - This set is all about trying to cheat things into play without paying and this continues the trend. If you have a way to cheat auras into play, this is the one.

Academy Rector turns out to be a decent way to cheat this into play.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMEmrakul - will see some play. I guess it's THE Oath target for now.

Add the other two here as well. They are all very much playables.


White:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMLightmine field - is a nice combo with humilty. Altough so is Moat and Moat actually does something alone (quite much actually) whereas this does not.

Crap. As predicted.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMLinvala - is decent, not great stats, but combined with the ability they are okay.

I've yet to see this one played outside of standard and I guess that will not change for a while. Printing of Fauna Shaman does make this more appealing though.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMLone Missionary - UW fish (or similiar strategy) might want this. Ninjas and other ways to replay this will make this decent enough to see play. Would not put this in without any recursion. There are better creatures then.

Haven't tried UW, so I have no idea if this even worth mentioning in that context.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMJudging by the hype, Gideon Jura seems to be a candidate for the best card in the set. I don't agree. I could be totally off here as I've had not a single game with him, but the fact is that he is not going to fit to every white deck. If you play Gideon, you better have some creatures that can actually deal damage (rather than deck full of 0/4 walls). In standard format this gets much better, but I would feel really unsure if someone awards him the best card of the set title. I'd say he sees more play than Tezzeret, but less than Elspeth for example.

I was little off here. You don't absoluely NEED to have creaures on the battlefield if you were to make this a profitable play. However, you really should play even some utility creatures in a deck with Gideon. Making cuple of nice trades and then Vengeancing****** their biggest one is huge in aggro MU. This is decnt against control as it doesn't die to sorcery speed creature removal and takes a lot of burn too. All in all, I feel that Tezzeret sees a little bit more play as this is only good in white control. Still a fine card.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMI really like Oust. In HL this is way better than in other formats as aggro tends to have near perfect curve because of the mulligan. Imagine this scenario: Opponent starts with Llanowar Elves, you play plains, Oust. They lose their first turn accelerant and will have to draw it again couple turns later unless they fetch or something. One mana non-condition removal is always something that will see play.

I am disappoint. Not good enough to be played in most decks. White removal needs to kill, not to mess up their curve and give them a life boost in the process. I am unsure if this ever should see play in competitive decks.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 23-04-2010, 10:53:55 AMRepel the Darkness - Maybe in some turbofog strategy or combo deck trying to buy some time. Long shot, but an option you might want to try out sometimes.

Could still find a deck.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMStudent of Warfare - is a great creature, will see play in WW and WW splash something decks.

Nothing to add. Great creature.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMI also like Survival Cache way more than I should, but unique effect is unique. I know why I should not like this (not reliable and upside is not that great), but I still have to sleeve this up and take a stab at it. Sees very narrow play, if any.

I think I can safely stop trying with this one. Kyle Sanchez proved that there is a home for this and that home is not in a 100-card deck.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMI also think Transcendent Master is going to be played in some decks that also play Gideon Jura. Sure, it requires hefty mana investment, but once you get the ball rolling, there is not much that can stop it. Three mana 3/3 is not that bad in a heavy white deck.

Another dork I overvalued. I guess I am sucker for creaures that give decent investment initially and provide additional rewards if you throw mana at them later.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMWall of Omens - It's not a new Wall of Blossoms. It's better.

Nothing to add. Everybody and their mother knows how good this is.


Blue:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMCoralhelm Commander - is good in fish decks (even when the side dish is not merfolk).

Spot on, baby.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMEnclave Cryptologist - Seems better than Merfolk looter/Thought Courier. Gets played in decks that want to loot.

Nothing to add.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMGravitational Shift - way too random to seem play.

Nothing to add.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMDeprive - Ugh. Just bad. Could be playable in standard, but wouldn't count on it.

Another one I undervalued. Fish likes two mana counters and the drawback is not too severe for that deck.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMDomestication - might be playble in mono blue. Control magic is great against aggro and blue has limited ways to deal with creatures. I first tought this was looking at the CMC, which would have made this way better.

Not playable.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMGuard gomazoa - Decks that want Fog Bank might want also this. Solid wall, but easily removed and one power is not good enough to kill pretty much anything.

Too expensive even for the ubiquotous Fog Bank deck.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 23-04-2010, 10:53:55 AMHalimar Wavewatch - Reasonable Wall, if you need more than just the better ones available. Doubles as a reasonable win condition.

Blue has too many great cards for a subpar wall to make appearance.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMMnemonic Wall - Izzet Chronarch sees no play. This somewhat beter, but not enough. I doubt it, but I am not surprised if I turn to be wrong.

Bad to the bone.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 23-04-2010, 10:53:55 AMNarcolepsy - Nice blue removal. It's bad against creatures with tap abilities that do relevant things, but cheap and in a color that might want sometimes to have the option of removing. Creatures with relevant tap abilities are not that common and if they require mana investment, Narcolepsy makes them play little awkward if they want to use their rebels or something.

Haven't tried this, haven't heard anyone playing this. Probably crap.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMRenegade doppelganger - I thought this would be good at first, but then I noticed it was until end of turn. Might see some play in some bizarre combo, but probably not. Cute with Phyrexian Dreadnought, though.

Bad, but I still leave te benefit of the doubt. This card could find it's way to HL if there is some nice combo to go with it.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMReality Spasm - wants home in a combo deck. Seems okay in High Tide. Either make mana, or tap down an opposing blue mage EOT.

Still haven't played enough High Tide to say if this even remotely playable here, but I listen to those with more experience and say this is not good in that deck. I do like the versatility of this still.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSea Gate Oracle - is good against WW and Black aggro, but 1/3 body rarely matter enough to stop aggro decks for attacking. It's decent, but nothing spectacular. Will see some play, far from autoinclude.

I've found myself autoincluding this when building a blue control. Probably not THAT good, but it is still pretty good.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSee Beyond - Woo-hoo. I likes. Especially when blue decks need to play dedicated answers to creatures and this can get rid of them cheaply. Not to be played in every blue deck. Counterspell heavy decks probably is not a place for this.

Should be played in a Oath or similar decks, but probably not elsewhere. I overvalued this one.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMShared Discovery - Very limited use as attacking with four creatures seems also pretty good strategy, I am not surprised to see this play however as one mana, draw three is tempting enough.

I've yet to see this one played, but the potential is there. Needs more good token producers.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSphinx of Magosi - is a great finisher, and will probably see some play. Cards like Keiga might just be better thoug and Keiga sees no play.

Have seen play, I think it's decent, but is very much deck dependant. Power creep might make this totally unplayable in couple of years.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMTraining grounds seems bad - Better as a value card than a combo card as all the combos require a creature and a third card. And building a deck around this is probably not a good idea. I like the synergy with Lavaclaw Reaches.

Needs more rebels!

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMUnified will - I would feel quite bad if I were playing this, but I have tendency to dislike situational cards. Memory lapse, Remand, Mana Leak are all better than this.

I didn't like it then and I have no reason to like this now.

Tiggupiru

Black:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMArrogant Bloodlord - Monoblack aggro. Not many 1/1's in this format and black traditionally has ways to deal with them. Not a superstar, but certainly a playable.

I still think this is playable, but black based aggro might not be. Maybe in a couple of years when the vampire synergies run amok.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMBloodthrone Vampire - Upgrade to Nantuko Husk/Phyrexian Ghoul/Vampire Aristocrat cycle. Weaker now that combat no longer stacks, but hey.

I like this, but I guess I am biased.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMConsume the meek - Not good enough. Does take out manlands, but that is more relevant in standard.

Nothing to add.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMConsuming Vapors - is getting seriously overhyped, but it still is quite a powerhouse. Taking one guy and then time walking is great. Just pack enough sweepers and instant removal to take out tokens and manlands. Playing around is easy, but in HL you really should not bother as it is unlikey to draw one. This fact makes it almost as good as it is hyped in HL. Could be the card in the set for HL

Not THE card for HL in this set, but I still find this very good.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMDrana, kalastria bloodchief - is a really nice finisher. MBC wants this. Probably even some BX control as well.

Still a good finisher in black based control. Probably could find home in certain types of aggrocontrols too.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMHellcarver - demon seems hilarious in hypergenesis, so might see narrow play.

Those who play Hypergenesis: Is this even remotely playable in that deck?

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMInquisition of Kozilek - is most likely too bad to draw after first couple of turns to see play. It's really great in this format if you happen to have it in your openening seven, though.

Another gem I undervalued. The autoinclude discard package consists of Thoughtseize, Duress and this. Not as good as the other two as it loses power later on, but is usually better than Seize and Duress if you have this on your opening hand.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 23-04-2010, 10:53:55 AMPawn of Ulamog - If you are already sacrificing creatures for profit, this might be decent. Also cheapens the Recurring Nightmare recursion.

You need some sick synergies to even consider this. I overvalued this.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSuffer the Past - looks decent in MBC as an instant drain life to the face. Tormod's crypt is just a bonus (or more accurately, a hinderance). Still, most likely sees some play. Awkward if you play other GY hate.

If your MBC really, really needs to drain life, play this. Otherwise, avoid at all costs.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMThought Gorger - looks almost playable, discarding 3-5 cards in turn 4 is okay, when you get at least 5/5 trampling body. Mono black aggro or similiar strategy could theoretically enlist him.

Not even near playable. The stats are there, but you need to discard 3-5 lands for this to be worth the effort. Discarding business is just weak. Besides, you might need to get rid of this afterwards, but your opponent has no reason to do so if he can produce blockers.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMVirulent Swipe - is a long shot, but with several first strikers this could be playable. Smiting a guy plus bull rushing seems fine.


Red:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMDevastating Summons - is like going all-in with a small pocket pair before the flop, you might get dominated by bigger pair (WoG), or slightly favorable against suited connectors (decks with non-burn spot removal) or dominate smaller pair (red decks). Too farfetched metaphor? You bet. Too farfetched to say this might see play? Nope.

Needs moar haste. Provide that and this wins totally out of the blue.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMEmrakul's Hatcher - seems decent if you have recurring nightmare action going on, might still be little underwhelming, but you basically need to pay BB1 to trigger the ETB triggers of another creature in your graveyard.

The Recurring Nightmare synergy is probably pointless and this is miserable without synergy.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMFlame Slash - if you have a red deck that is not concerned to burn your opponent but needs to take out some creatures, this is good.

I am still not sure if this kind of deck exists, but if it does...

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMForked Bolt - is probably better in decks that want to play just the fire side of Fire/Ice, but is there a deck like this? Maybe there will be.

This sees play in some aggro decks so this is indeed better than Fire.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMHellion Eruption - seems like it's a six mana glorious anthem with suspend. Even when it would give +3/+3, it's not very convincing. More accurate comparison might be overrun (with suspend) as this does nothing if you have no guys out. Making your creatures easier to remove is also relevant. I would not play this card anywhere.

Still crap.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMKargan Dragonlord - I don't like him that much, but it's still very much playable in mono red. I imagine this flying over some very frustrated Kor Firewalkers in type II.

I've grown to like this more recently, but other than that, nothing to add.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSplinter Twin - EOT Pestermite, then this. Could be.

It still could be.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMStaggershock - The other "could be the best card in the set", as three mana 4 damage without a drawback is good and splitting it to two targets is great. Taking one creature down while doming 2 is not as good as goptimal Searing Blaze, but taking two guys out is.

Very nice burn. Solid.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMTuktuk the Explorer - Warren Instigator dropping this and Siege-Gand = good times. Goblin tend to get sacrificed anyway, so this can trigger easily, but this probably won't make the cut in most decks. Goblins want to try this one out.

I have no idea about this one. Probably synergies is not going to make this worth the effort. I still refuse to call this one unplayable.

Green:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMAncient Stirrings - is a card I like a LOT. Finding a land is good, but can also pick up some nice artifact.

No idea what kind of deck wants this, but should be decent in that particular deck. Got little worse after Loam got banned, but remains as an option for rogue deckbuilders.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMAwakening Zone - is good. Probably even great. Ramping up and/or stalling aggro is good. Repeat after me: Earthcraft. Also Opposition.

Not great, probably not even good. Three mana is just too much. Decent in your Polymorph.dec.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMGrowth Spasm - If you play this, your deck probably has several 6 drops.

Nothing to add.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMHaze Frog - could be playable if there is a good way to recur him. Wouldn't hold my breath though.

Glad I was not holding breath. I don't think this should see play even when you recur it.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMJoraga Treespeaker - is great on the first turn. Elf decks will most likely want her.

I still fancy this one, not as good as Llanowar Elves or the like.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMKhalni Hydra - is something Day of Judgment wished for his birthday present. Probably sees play if monoG aggro is a deck, but really shouldn't.

Badbadbad.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMMomentous Fall - is most likely too random to make any impact in HL enviroinment. Unless you play Awkening Zone, Growth Spasm and all the other ramp equipment along with the six mana fatties. I'd cut this for the Greater Good (See, LSV? I can also make horrible puns too!).

Still too random.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMMul Daya Channelers - in HL you probably need some library manipulation to make this work, but if you get the percentages right, this is potent weapon.

I have no idea about this one. There are many good cards to pair this with, but the card needs to do something without them to be playable.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMPelakka Wurm - provides seven life and sizeable body, might see play in decks that can SNEAK him into play. And perhaps even ATTACK with him on the same turn.

Sneak Attacking with this is okay, but obviously there are better creatures for that. I like this in the reanimator decks as a replacement for Ancestor's Chosen. This has more relevant body, enough life gain to matter and Trample to render chump blockers useless. Great against planeswalkers that Trampling ability is as well.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMRealms Uncharted - Not as good as I thought it was. Still very much playable. Petrified Field should also be in deck if you choose to play this.

Is it playable? After Loam got the ban, this is probably too weak. I am unsure if it were even before that.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMVengevine - is not that good in HL. You can't build your deck around it and you really should play cards that are better overall, rather than creatures that it has synergy with. Also, you can never return more than Vengevine in HL, so this is not that good. 4 mana 4/3 haste is however by itself often enough to see play in the right deck. Great before and after Wrath of God as hasted creature is something control decks don't want to see after sweeping the board.

Green aggro that has curve that doesn't stop at three wants this.

Multicolor:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMSarkhan the Crap - is not playable. It probably sees some play early on as people are unable to correctly identify its power level. 5 mana is a lot and any Black and Red deck that would like to play Sarkhan will play cards with high CMC, thus making Sarkhan a poor card draw machine. The second ability is probably a little bit better, but nothing spectacular. Upgrading one of your own dorks is not ideal unless you have a stedy source of tokens. In this case, Goblin Bushwhacker or similiar is better.

Sarkhan is slighly more playable than i originally predicted, because I undervalued the second ability. Not like this is good or anything. Some Jund type token deck may provide a reasonable home  for this.


Artifact:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMAngelheart Vial - even though you can trigger this by yourself, it's not going to cut it. Fun in multiples and painlands or something.

Nothing has changed here.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMDreamstone Hedron - make some mana or draw some cards. Will see narrow play in Stax type of decks and is probably decent there.

Have no idea if this sees, or if this one should see play. Six mana is a lot to play for a Thran Dynamo.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMProphetic Prism - if you can abuse this somehow it's okay. Without recursion, too narrow unless you try to go from full nonbasic manabase desperately towards a deck that does not autolose to blood moon.

Nothing to add.


Land:


Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMEvolving Wilds - is as good as Terramorphic Expanse. DUUUUUH.

Maybe a little bit better than Terramorphic.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMI doubt any totem armor is good enough. Only one that has a shot is Bear Umbra and mayyyybe Boar Umbra, I would be somewhat surprised to see the latter though.

Well, I was kind of off as Hyena Umbra is the best for HL, but I am unimpressed about this. I would not play it (or any other) in anywhere.

Quote from: Tiggupiru on 22-04-2010, 09:53:06 PMEvery leveler is also better than they first look (well, maybe not the absolute worst). And most of them are good against blue based control as they don't cost much to be cast and are huge if slip past the wall of counterspells. Lighthouse Chronologist is flat-out hilarious in a monoblue mirror.

Kinda true, but only the absolute best are worth sleeving.



Cards I didn't mention previously:


Nest Invader - Decent accelerant with a decent body. Something you might want to consider if you really want to ramp to 4 on turn 3.

Guul Draz Assasin - Have no idea if this is good enough for even marginal play. I am in process of finding out.