Help with my WW deck

[Tiggupiru]

I think Mangara of corondor is not that bad of a choice as many think here.
He has Karakas and if he draws both unanswered thats gg . Furthermore he can tutor karakas with wayfarer. I would not cut Mangara ;-)

1/1 and a nonbasic land that go unanswered seems rather unlikely scenario, don't you think? Not to mention, vindicate for every other turn is far from gg, even though it is a powerful synergy.

[Asmahasmalaria]

ok its maybe not gg, but a powerful thread ;-)

[kriisi]

if you want to play mangara+karakas, why not add thousand-year elixir?
maybe a bit suboptimal but the deck seems to already have quite a few
critters with T: x abilities. mother of runes, javelineer, whipcorder etc.
so vindicate every turn instead of every other.

[Mythrandir]

I think that mangara isnt that great in a WW. These kind of decks need deal the biggest amount of damage in the shortest time possible, and a 3 CMC 1/1 isn't very good in that plan, IMO. yes, you can do some nifty tricks with it, but it's a bit too suboptimal IMO.

[Dreamer]

Yeah, Mangara is probably a bit too slow. Tivadar of Thorn or something instead, perhaps?

[GoblinPiledriver]

Mangara of Condor:  good card, but with no haste and 1/1 he will never be the best card.

Tivadar of Thorn: a metagame card, perfect against red goblin decks, but bad against other decks

thousand-year elixir: With Managara and Karakas this card is a bomb. But without them this card is only crap. This card was printed as a crap rare, and will ever be. 3 mana for almost nothing is too hard. If you are planing to support Managara then you should use Lightning Greaves.

[Vazdru]

I need some help with my WW too  

A) Equipments

Actually i play following equipments:

* Sword of Fire and Ice
* Sword of Light and Shadow
* Grafted Wargear
* Bonesplitter

Would you prefer one of the following equipments or would play it in addition to the mentioned ones (toolbox for Stoneforge Mystic) - in a meta with 60% aggro (RDW, Zoo), 30% midrange-control (Survival, UB, UW-Control) and 10% combo?

* Empyrial Plate (had some decent game winnings with plate + land tax)
* Lightning Greaves
* Basilisk Collar
* Mask of Memory
* Sigil of Distinction
* Hammer of Ruin (I've lost several times vs Sword of Light and Shadow and/or Sword of Fire and Ice)

I play actually 46 creatures, 35 lands, 19 spells (incl. Beckon Apparition plus Spectral Procession)


B) Pump

- Enchantements (x = in my deck actually)

obv. best one: Honor of the Pure (x) plus ??

CC2
Crusade (x)

CC3
Divine Sacrament
Glorious Anthem

CC4
Light from Within?
Marshal's Anthem


- Buddies (x = in my deck actually)

CC3
Pianna Nomad Captain (x)
Soltari Champion (x)

CC4
Wilt-Leaf Liege (x)
Celestial Crusader


C)

Decissions ?!

* Jotun Grunt vs Sigiled Paladin
* Mana Tithe vs Cloudgoat Ranger (too slow?, in some matches he was the matchwinner)
* Windbrisk Heights (tapped, non-basic) vs Plains
* Which manlands: Mishra's Factory, Mutavault, Blinkmoth Nexus, Dread Statuary (underestmated card) ? - I've lost almost all games facing a T4 Damnation, WoG, DoJ, often my opponent was already low on lp, with a manland i would have maybe won
* Rebel-Chain incl. Amrou Scout, Mirror Entity added Whipcorder + Aven Riftwatcher as well - good choice?
* i play Flickerwisp + Kor Hookmaster - Wisp is quite good, Kor Hookmaster is ok - better add Otherworldly Journey instead of Hookmaster?
* Beckon Apparition vs. nother one drop (play 9 one-drops actually)
* Raise the Alarm - still good?

[GoblinPiledriver]

A)The equipments you play are a good choice, especially with Stoneforge Mystic. I would add Mask of Memory, because you have in WW many creatures with evasion and you can improve your hand in a strong way.
The other equipments you metioned are not really worth playing in comparison to the equipments which are already in your deck.

B)For Pump you not mentioned Elspeth and Ajani Goldmane. For me this both PW are the best available, and are fitting in the categorie Pump.

C)

+ Sigiled Paladin + Jotun Grunt
Both are very strong maybe you should cut an other card.(If you really want a decision + Paladin)

+ Mana Tithe  - Cloudgoat Ranger
Mana Tithe surprises too much, the Cloudgoat Ranger comes too late.

+ Plains      - Windsbrisk Heights
In such decks you usually don't find a good card which it's worth the CIP ability of the Heights.

+ Mishra's Factory, Mutavault, Blinkmoth Nexus   - Dread Statuary
The first both are very good. The third is nice but the Statuary is very expensive.

+ Kor Hookmaster - Otherworldly Journey
The Hookmaster is great in creature combat, the journey is just awful.

- Raise the Alarm
When you are facing aggro decks, you are facing many strong creatures. This card becomes better the more control decks are being played.

I like the Rebel Chain but it's not very strong, maybe you should be stayed on the main strategy.

[Vazdru]

here my complete list of 2-drops:

1,Amrou Scout
1,Honor of the Pure
1,Kami of Ancient Law
1,Kor Skyfisher
1,Mistral Charger
1,Ronom Unicorn
1,Soltari Trooper
1,Stoneforge Mystic
1,Stormfront Pegasus
1,Azorius Guildmage
1,Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
1,Knight of Meadowgrain
1,Knight of the Holy Nimbus
1,Kor Aeronaut
1,Leonin Skyhunter
1,Serra Avenger
1,Sigiled Paladin
1,Silver Knight
1,Soltari Monk
1,Soltari Priest
1,Whipcorder


bzw. last tourney I've reached semifinals with WW (27 participants, 5 rounds + Top 8 )

I've added Ajani meanwhile and cut Lightning Greaves again.

[grizzledmage]

Here's one kind of out of the blue...

I have been painstakingly putting up my surplus cards (I'm embarrassed to tell you how many there are!) on Cardshark.com, and I ran across my extra copies of Guardian of the Guildpact, from Dissension.

Guardian of the Guildpact 
Cost :   3W 
Type :   Creature - Spirit 
Power :   2/3 
Wording : Protection from monocolored.

I started looking at it more closely for my WW deck. Yes the cost (4) is high for a 2/3 creature, but the protection from monocolor would make it difficult to block or remove. Plus, with all the pumping enchantments that WW typically uses, plus the good equipments, this could be a force to reckon with.

Thoughts?

[GoblinPiledriver]

4 is too expensive and it's really only 2/3.
The real problem is you need to win quick before your opponent packs out his synergies or bigger creatures. And so this creature is coming too late. Beside that there are lots of multicolor creatures and a few colorless artifact creatures that degredaded the Guardian of the Guildpact.


If you really like good creatures with protection than you may try this:

Beloved Chaplain  1W
Creature - Human Cleric   1/1
Protection from creatures


or a enchantment,with cantrip, which you can use on maybe big creatures:

Unquestioned Authority 2W
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant creature
When Unquestioned Authority enters the battlefield, draw a card.
Enchanted creature has protection from creatures.

[Happy Little Boozer]

Maybe we can consider and discuss new cards regarding WW which were released since the last post ~20 month ago. I just had a look over the recently released editions:

Token:
Gather the Townsfolk - I didn't saw Raise the Alarm for years; maybe better in Tokenmania.dec
Midnight Haunting - worse Spectral Procession; instant speed is not relevant;
Lingering Souls - maybe in a slower WWbx build, but i can't imagine the card in a straight WW
Mausoleum Guard - 2/2 body for cmc 4 is bad and there are easier ways to get 2 flying tokens; maybe god in boardsweeperheavy meta; but if i consider bounce and exile effects i would definetly avoid this guy
Doomed Traveler - fits better in the ww concept than Mausoleum Guard; still don't convince me

2-Drops
Elite Inquisitor - instead of a Kazandu Blademaster. But in general vigilance is on of the less important keywords a WW creature should have. I'm not used to all creature types of highlander creatures but i would guess Vampires, Werewolves and Zombies are quite rare.
Spectral Rider - since most creature heavy decks play white (WW, Boros, Naya, xcolorZoo), intimidate (white) there are safer evasions
Silverchase Fox - since WW doesn't care about lategame definetly worse than Ancient Kami and Ronom Unicorn
Porcelain Legionnaire - even if he's weak against decks with Mountains he's is a solid beater; lifeloss usually doesn't matter
Selfless Cathar / Armored Warhorse - no comment; maybe in a budget version
Loyal Cathar / Unhallowed Cathar - 1st creature is quite bad in comparison to possibilities white offers. a free second creature which is even worse; maybe I underestimate this guy?
Niblis of the Urn - tap a blocker for free sounds very nice; in the lategame a "{W}{T}:Tap"-guy is probably better
Cloistered Youth / Unholy Fiend - i would prefer the Armored Warhorse Oó
Puresteel Paladin - usually the equipments (=swords) win the game if unhandled. can't imagine a deck with the paladin and how he should constantly improve these situations.

Thalia, Guardian of Thraben - I would not automatically suggest her for all WW lists. If you run many creatures and your opponent shouldn't play too many spells she supports the strategy
Grand Abolisher - I tried him in a couple of non-competitive matches with a disappointing result. Depending on the meta he can shine.
Mentor of the Meek - I didn't played him yet so i can only imagine how strong he would be (without Anthem-effects). in fact around 95% of the creatures would trigger him.

unsorted:
Gideon's Lawkeeper - Human Goldmeadow Harrier; but if you play cmc1 tapper one is probably enough
Mikaeus, the Lunarch - every Anthem-effect is faster and therefore better
Vault Skirge - all in all worse than Suntail Hawk etc.
Guardians' Pledge - can't imagine this over random anthem effect
Blade Splicer - 4 power for cmc 3 is quite rare in White. If you think of recurring cipEnter the Battlefield-Triggers someone already mentioned before (Kor Skyfisher, Flickerwisp, Stonecloaker, Parallax Wave...), she gets pretty annoying.

Lands:
Inkmoth Nexus - Without any secret infect tech I prefer Blinkmoth Nexus if at all
Contested War Zone - No idea yet, but i guess it' all about the meta again

------------------
I hope that there are more/other opinions about these cards and everything is understandable.

Auf Wiedersehen

p.s. I just realized that the previous post was in 2010 instead of 2011. Therefore, another year of yet 'unrecognized' cards for this WW-Thread had just appeared.

[so_not]

Here's a version I played a while ago (pre DA) in a small tournament and went 3-2:
1 Elite Vanguard
1 Figure of Destiny
1 Isamaru, Hound of Konda
1 Mother of Runes
1 Savannah Lions
1 Soltari Foot Soldier
1 Suntail Hawk
1 Lantern Kami
1 Student of Warfare
1 Gideon's Lawkeeper
1 Champion of the Parish
1 Icatian Javelineers
1 Goldmeadow Harrier

1 Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
1 Knight of the White Orchid
1 Kor Aeronaut
1 Kor Skyfisher
1 Leonin Arbiter
1 Leonin Relic-Warder
1 Leonin Skyhunter
1 Mistral Charger
1 Serra Avenger
1 Soltari Monk
1 Soltari Priest
1 Soltari Trooper
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Stormfront Pegasus
1 Porcelain Legionnaire
1 Accorder Paladin
1 Grand Abolisher
1 Spectral Rider
1 Raise the Alarm

1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Mirran Crusader
1 Spectral Procession
1 Flickerwisp
1 Fiend Hunter
1 Midnight Haunting
1 Blade Splicer
1 Stillmoon Cavalier
1 Soltari Champion

1 Hero of Bladehold
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Battle Screech
1 Celestial Crusader
1 Geist-Honored Monk
1 Cloudgoat Ranger
1 Mikaeus, the Lunarch

1 Path to Exile
1 Mana Tithe
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Sunlance
1 Dismember
1 Brave the Elements
1 Cursed Scroll
1 Crusade
1 Journey to Nowhere

1 Glorious Anthem
1 Divine Sacrament
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Honor of the Pure
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Angelic Destiny
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant

1 Chrome Mox
1 Windbrisk Heights
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Mishra's Factory
1 Wasteland
1 Mutavault
1 Contested War Zone
25 Plains

Losses were against Staxx (obv, although I won 1 game) and a pseudomirror. Won UGR, UW and Dredgeanimator. I had to try out those one mana fliers because all WW lists seem to play them for some reason. And oh boy were they bad I'll snapcut them before playing this again. Otherwise the deck felt ok.

Gather the Townsfolk - This should be decent
Midnight Haunting - Instancy has actually been surprisingly relevant
Mausoleum Guard, Doomed Traveler - bleh
Elite Inquisitor - not good enough I think. Two drops should have good evasion or better stats.
Spectral Rider - Generic WW-creature, this goes in and out all the time.
Porcelain Legionnaire - decent beater
Loyal Cathar / Unhallowed Cathar - I think I'll try this out. It does produce some card advantage at least.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben - I'll definitely try this one. Such a beater in standard already.
Grand Abolisher - I like this dude a lot. One of the best new bears. But then again we have pretty much monocontrolmeta here in Finland.
Mentor of the Meek - This was way too slow and clunky in testing.
Mikaeus, the Lunarch - This is pretty powerful. It's very versatile and tutorable with Ranger of Eos!
Blade Splicer - Definitely powerful.
Contested War Zone - This has been pretty sick so far.

[SpoCk0nd0pe]

I still think weathered wayfarer is a pretty good card to fetch wasteland, WW is low on cardadvantage and wasteland (and maybe dustbowl/tectonic edge) will help your gameplan. For me, maze of ith proved to be quite a strong card even in pure aggro. I also like jotun grunt a lot. He is good gy hate (something WW lacks), stays reasonably long and is absolutely sick if drawn with wayfarer (wasteland recursion!). You play Stoneforge, where is the Batterskull? Since your curve ends at 4, you might consider Baneslayer, Gideon and elspeth tirel for powercreeps
I did not count your legends, Eiganjo Castle might be a card you want to look at though.
What about armageddon? It's quite strong the classic WW.

Hope that helped,
-- Spock

[so_not]

I still think weathered wayfarer is a pretty good card to fetch wasteland, WW is low on cardadvantage and wasteland (and maybe dustbowl/tectonic edge) will help your gameplan. For me, maze of ith proved to be quite a strong card even in pure aggro. I also like jotun grunt a lot. He is good gy hate (something WW lacks), stays reasonably long and is absolutely sick if drawn with wayfarer (wasteland recursion!). You play Stoneforge, where is the Batterskull? Since your curve ends at 4, you might consider Baneslayer, Gideon and elspeth tirel for powercreeps
I did not count your legends, Eiganjo Castle might be a card you want to look at though.
What about armageddon? It's quite strong the classic WW.

Hope that helped,
-- Spock

I could try Wayfarer instead of an 1-drop flyer. I really hesitate adding any more colorless lands and Dust Bowl is too expensive to use anyway. Maze of Ith really doesn't Belong in aggro decks. With Maze you are untapping opponent's creatures which totally works against your plan. It doesn't even produce mana so if you need a similar effect then Kor Haven would be better. I tried to cut all situational cards like Jotun Grunt. Graveyard hate isn't very relevant if you can't tutor it and synergy with one card in the deck doesn't make it good enough.
This is really an aggro deck in its purest form and Batterskull doesn't support that plan. In slower decks if they kill your Mystic you can reliably play Batterskull later but with this amount of lands you can't really bet on it. I opted for Cloudgoat and Geist Honored Monk as curve toppers in this version mostly because of multiple Crusade-effects. They also generate card advantage, something that's not the case with Baneslayer. I really don't have an opinion about Gideon in this kind of deck but will surely consider it if I end up adding another fivedrop.
Classic doesn't always mean good and Geddon-effects are something that wasn't going to do much in the expected meta. Since most decks nowadays pack a whole bunch of creatures it is hard to create a board position that's favorable for Geddoning. So I rather filled those slots with cards that advance my board position or give reach.